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How This is Not like the Ordination of Women

by Sarah Wilson March 20, 2009

A background issue to the ELCA Task Force Recommendations, not mentioned in the document itself but still in the minds and mouths of many, is how this whole situation does or does not compare to the ordination of women. People on opposite extremes tend to link the two...

A background issue to the ELCA Task Force Recommendations, not mentioned in the document itself but still in the minds and mouths of many, is how this whole situation does or does not compare to the ordination of women. People on opposite extremes tend to link the two.

On the one side, the ordination of women is the first step in a progressive movement to award the right of ordination to those who have previously been denied it. Ordaining women is the logical precursor to the ordaining of homosexuals, and praise God in both cases that our old bigotries are falling away.

On the other side, the ordination of women was the first step of devolution away from fidelity to Scripture and mass sexual confusion. It is a big old slippery slope: if you start ordaining women, you’ll inevitably ordain homosexuals, and heaven only knows what will come next.

There is a linkage between the two, but it is not a theological linkage, rather a sociocultural one. The issue has been forced on the church from the outside, to a certain extent, by huge social changes. Responding to the culture is not in itself good or bad. The church has done so wisely in some cases (rejecting slavery and racism) and badly in others (embracing Hitler). The decisive issue for the church is whether movements in the culture, and proposed responses to it in the church, are in keeping with the gospel of Jesus Christ which is witnessed to normatively by the Scriptures.

So, for instance, when the ordination of women has been accepted in the church as a matter of rectification for past injustices within a narrative of liberal democracy’s upward track of overcoming all oppression, or in deliberate opposition to the tradition of church as altogether a bad egg, or in utter disregard of the Scriptures one way or another, it has been a heresy. When the ordination of women has been accepted as a practice in keeping with the church’s teaching on the trinitarian God, the incarnation of the Logos in Jesus for the salvation of all persons, and the anthropological unity proclaimed in the Scriptures and modeled in certain women (Gen. 1:27, Gal. 3:28; the judge Deborah, the prophet Huldah, the apostle Junia, the teacher Priscilla), it has been orthodoxy. I think it is safe to say that the churches that ordain women today have accepted the practice in both heretical and orthodox ways, and which mode of acceptance is the winning one is still not clear.

But it is important to see here what the key difference is between the ordination of women and the ordination of homosexuals. The argument against ordaining women has pertained to two things: 1) their competence and 2) their nature or ontology. The first argument has been dispensed with by nearly all persons in the church at this point in time (though, sadly, not all). The second argument, regarding their ontology, received fairly minimal attention until the 20th century. (When it did get attention earlier, it was generally linked to a belief in women's inferiority and incompetence, not simply "otherness," which is the way it is usually read today.) Relevant to the discussion here is that it is an absolute kind of argument: a woman is a woman is a woman, and no amount of competence will change that. Nature bars her from service, period. The change in practice hinges on how the ontology of “woman” is understood, in the light of the Trinity, the incarnate Christ, and the Scriptures.

The argument against the ordination of homosexuals is not about either their ontology or their competence. It is actually of little relevance whether homosexuals are born or made (if such an absolute distinction could be made anyway). The issue pertains strictly to a matter of behavior. Certainly there is no doubt that homosexuals can be competent for the ministry. By contrast, no amount of behavior one way or another could make any difference to a woman barred from ordination on account of her ontology. So here the change in practice hinges on how the behavior of homosexuals is understood, in the light of the Trinity, the incarnate Christ, and the Scriptures.

For strategic reasons, the two changes in ordination practice have been linked, in one case to promote the ordination of homosexuals, and in the other case to invalidate both. But it is a logical error to link them; they are distinct issues. If there is any connection beyond the cultural, it is anti-theological rather than theological, in the sense that the heretical promotion of the ordination of women outlined above very possibly set a precedent for how Scripture is handled in the ELCA and other mainline churches today.

I end on an autobiographical note. In my very young adulthood I was opposed to the ordination of women because I had not heard adequate arguments for it from a theological point of view. What changed my mind were the scriptural and patristic arguments of the Eastern Orthodox theologian Elisabeth Behr-Sigel (on whom I eventually wrote my dissertation). It was through her that I saw for the first time the theologically and scripturally faithful and orthodox case for the ordination of women, and as a result I changed my mind (and even got ordained!). Despite the Task Force’s claims that equally scriptural convictions are held on all sides (though note the subtle differences in language when the two principal positions are described), I have yet to see any arguments in favor of blessing homosexual behavior that even come close to touching those in favor ordaining women. Intellectually and theologically they are worlds apart. I suspect that the distance between these worlds cannot actually be bridged.

Celibacy

Posted by Dena Williams at March 22, 2009 22:35
Yes, there are different issues involved:
You and I, my dear, did not have to promise celibacy to be ordained.

A Promise, or a Gospel directed to follow?

Posted by Joe Congregation Member at March 25, 2009 17:18
And Jesus said, “Neither do I condemn you. Go your way, and from now on do not sin again.”
---
Compromise, in the "Library," has never worked out for the compromising, but for those to whom they compromised...?

No linkage?

Posted by Henry B. at March 23, 2009 03:34
I'm not sure that I agree with your assertion that the issue of women's ordination and the issue of homosexual blessings have no intellectual or theological linkage, Sarah. In his 1976 sermon entitled, "Who's Church Is It?-Receiving Women Pastors" Edward Schroeder succinctly expresses the theological fears surrounding the issue of women's ordination back then and today. He states, "But what if we are wrong? The risk element is never totally absent. Suppose that on judgment day, or even before, we get the message loud and clear: You were wrong in your conclusions favoring women pastors. What then?"

One need only substitute the word "homosexual" for "women" in the above example to see that the theological angst confronting the Church is exactly the same. One can argue, as you have, that they are worlds apart, because ontology, in the case of women's ordination, and behavior, in the case of homosexuals, are completely different nouns. But,I sense that this argument may simply be an unconscious attempt at whistling in the dark . . .

Response to Henry B

Posted by Sarah Wilson at March 23, 2009 07:39
Dear Henry, What you just pointed out in fact supports my contention: it is not an intellectual or theological factor, but the fear factor. Yes, let us be open and honest about the fear involved! Fear of God is something to be commended and taken seriously, not shoved under the carpet. But fear is not the same thing as an argument.

Fear of God

Posted by Henry B. at March 23, 2009 13:54
Hi Sarah,

Perhaps our difference of opinion regarding the theological underpinnings of "fear" is one of semantics. I do agree with your argument that there is less theological support for homosexual ordination than there is for women's ordination. But perhaps you would agree that the ultimate question which the ELCA's Task Force has totally(deliberately?)avoided asking in its discussions on same-sex blessings (but still remains in the minds and mouths of those who oppose it),is: "What if we're wrong?" To paraphrase the thief on the cross, the question we must ask ourselves as well as the ELCA Task Force is: "Do you not fear God?"

It seems to me that our sociocultural enlightenment easily trumps Scriptural admonitions nowadays, especially when words of Law are not to our liking, and we end up, unwittingly perhaps, becoming antinomians who are no longer able to resurrect absolutes once our fears have been extinguished. But for those who retain a Law written upon the heart, this fear remains whether it be women's or homosexual ordination in the church, and links the two issues inseparably, in my opinion.

further response to Henry B

Posted by Sarah Wilson at March 23, 2009 21:09
Dear Henry, I am certainly in agreement with you as to this kind of linkage, and it does seem that there is a basic refusal to address both the fear and the possibility that the proposed position could be wrong. My main purpose in this short article was to argue against the intellectual/theological attempt to link the two kinds of ordination.

Another link . . .

Posted by Henry B. at March 24, 2009 14:26
Sarah,

You have rightly stated that movements in the culture that ask for change in the church must be in keeping with the gospel, as witnesses to normatively by the Scriptures. I might add, that the model of such change should be in keeping with Paul's handling of the meat controversy (1 Cor. 10:14-32). Unfortunately, the laying aside of one's won "rights" by one group in the present situation is not what is advocated in the ELCA Task Force's recommendations.

Instead, I would argue that there is widespread confusion over the Law/Gospel dialectic in the ELCA which has been and is being used quite effectively by progressives in their quest for change. I dare say that it has its roots in the discussions which surrounded women's ordination back in the 70s.

Wittingly or not, it goes something like this. Identify a "victim" in the church (women,homosexuals, etc.). Claim that adherence to that words of Law is being synergistic, legalistic and bigoted. Demand that the Church then choose between Law and Gospel. And voila, Gospel wins (and so do we)!

It is no longer Law and Gospel but a Gospel first, Law second paradigm that is the norm in the ELCA. This Barthian Law/Gospel inversion neutralizes any opposition to "love", "Gospel" or "the Spirit". The motive behind this is not love, by any stretch of the imagination, but a deep-seated, antinomian hatred for authority.

This same theological slight of hand happens repeatedly. One recent example can be seen in the discussions that surround the issue of infant baptism in the ELCA. Proponents have identified the victim (children & infants) and declared that prohibiting them from communing is akin to a semi-pelagian heresy. Create a false sense of guilt, disguised as "grace", and we have nice little hammer for change.

Hate for God, which we are all guilty of by our nature, can parade around as love quite effectively in the church when the Law has been neutralized. And the consequence of replacing sinners with victims demanding their rights in the church ultimately destroys doctrine of justification: the doctrine on which the church stands or falls.


Henry B.

Posted by Error at March 24, 2009 16:11
Paragraph 5 above should read: Infant Communion

My apologies for the error. . . .

reply to Another Link

Posted by Sarah Wilson at March 26, 2009 09:52
This victim-oriented approach to change in church practice is exactly what I would qualify as a "heretical reception of the ordination of women." I suspect many supporters AND detractors of ordaining women ground their reasoning on this victim-oriented approach; in both cases I think they are wrong.

Yes, I do fear God.

Posted by Joe Congregation Member at March 25, 2009 17:24
Maybe Just as Martin may have, or not...

“You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination.”

The floor finally recognizes the 800lb gorilla in this debate

Posted by John at April 02, 2009 17:32
How is this present debate over scripture in the church not anything other than an extension of the slippery social slope that began with women's ordination? How can women, especially those ordained, say, "OK for us, but no further"? Where is the intellectual honesty? Yeah, I get it--St Paul didn't flat-out say, "only male clergy." But, neither did he say, "only straight clergy." Yes, we have a similar paucity of instruction on the matter from our Lord. Perhaps they didn't say it because the necessity for saying it never would have crossed their minds, but not simply because their society was different at the time, or because they were addressing a specific issue at a specific time, but because that's the way God intended it to be, universally. Again, I come back to wonder whether subtle temptation of Satan in the Garden who appeals to our desire for equality with God by challenging His Word--"Did God really say..." Am I being too ontological?

The Ordination of Women and the Bible

Posted by Rik at April 21, 2009 23:46
I presume the idea that women can and should be ordained is a foregone conclusion by now. I imagine most ELCAers would say, "Let's move beyond that. We've already won that battle decades ago." While I do not have any insights to share regarding the possible connection between women's ordination and active homosexual ordination, I do have a question: Why did our Lord Jesus Christ not choose at least one woman as one of His twelve disciples? He certainly could have. Why not? If we say the world was not ready for that at that time, were they ready for him to choose fishers, a tax collector, et al.? He didn't mind challenging that day's society by speaking to a Samaritan woman at a well. Why not choose her as one of the twelve? For that matter, He could have chosen His mother Mary to be among the twelve, to defy ageism. Alas, He didn't. But what about Galatians 3:28 "Their is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are allone in Christ Jesus..." There is no longer male or female? My wife and I seem to have differences, anatomy included. In context, the passage is referring to in salvation, there is no difference. Christ's payment of sins covers ALL people. It does not say that the difference between men and women just disappeared. I am thankful for the women who actively witnessed their faith in that first century, yet I still would like to know why Jesus did not say (according to that which is contained in the Holy Bible) to a woman, "Come, follow me...and I will make you a fisher of men." Any thoughts?

Mary, Johanna, Martha . . .

Posted by Dena Williams at April 27, 2010 04:47
Jesus did have women disciples, lots of them. When the men wrote the stories, they elected not to emphasize that fact.

Ordination of Women

Posted by Rev. Paul T. McCain at April 02, 2009 17:43
The problem with the assertions in this article is that they neglect the reality that the same methods, principles and approaches to Scripture, and what is more, the same conclusions, do lead from women's ordination to ordination of homosexuality. The ordination of women is entirely outside the teaching and practice of the church catholic and, if you will, the evangelical church catholic as well. This post fails to account for the Biblical texts themselves and our Lord and His Apostles' action.

The same errors in Biblical interpretation and the same error in fidelity to the Lord's Word as given through His apostles underlies both the ordination of women to the pastoral office and the ordination of homosexuals to the office.

I have heard from a number of ELCA women pastors who have come now to understand that their ordination is entirely out of line with the Dominical and Apostolic Word and do see how it has led, inevitably, to the ordination of homosexuals.

Many of us are praying that the precipitous and what appears to be near-certain acceptance of the ordination of actively homosexual persons will perhaps be a necessary wake-up call helping people to see that these actions are but symptoms of much deeper theological problems.

Now in Print

Spring 2013


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In this issue:

What If the Shroud of Turin
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Jesus Christ, Horror-Defeater

Universal Ordination
and Local Ministry

Things We Never
Preach About, Part 3:
Sexual Abuse

Thou Shalt Not Cheat
Prospective Lutherans!

The Samaritan Woman
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